Irishteen

You know what makes it worse the same people are having the same argument on another message board...

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fedeu2

Not me!

Popmartijn

Yep, they're copy-pasting the exact posts to and from the UKMix forum.
UKMIX - Forums - Chart Analysis - U2 360 TOUR: Boxscores, Statistics

So please, do the bickering over there and post the final consensus/conclusion here.

Maoilbheannacht

What parts of the mid-west and do you actually have any boxscores to back that claim up? As for Vancouver, will see who has the higher gross later this year. Where is your evidence for Minneapolis?


Well, lets take a look at this. Where are AC/DC playing stadium shows in the United States this year, the New York city area and Boston, two of the largest markets in the United States.

MOGGIO claims that the reason both stadium shows are not soldout is because AC/DC has played both markets before. But he neglects to tell when, where, and how many shows they played before these two stadium shows in these markets.


BOSTON:

9 November 2008 TD Banknorth Garden


NEW YORK CITY:

12 November 2008 Madison Square Garden
13 November 2008 Madison Square Garden
19 November 2008 Izod Center

The arena shows are all played in a 270 configuration not using the seats behind the stage. Average attendance for these shows was about 16,000 at best.


The upcoming stadium shows:

BOSTON:

28 July 2009 Gillette Stadium


NEW YORK CITY:

31 July 2009 Giants Stadium



Both stadium shows have had to reduce their low ticket prices to the $30 dollar range, yet still no sellouts, even of tickets at that price. While playing to around 45,000 people last November in the New York City area might explain their inability to sellout Giants Stadium this year, only ONE 15,000 seat arena show is unlikely to have much of an impact in achieving a sellout for Gillette Stadium near Boston almost a year later.

Maoilbheannacht

Well, Moggio, here are some facts from the A Bigger Bang Tour that you seemed to have missed:

STONES: A Bigger Bang Tour
European Tour 1ST LEG:


11/07/2006 Stadio Giuseppe Meazza - Milan, Italy
14/07/2006 Ernst Happel Stadion - Vienna, Austria
16/07/2006 Olympiastadion - Munich, Germany
19/07/2006 AWD Arena - Hanover, Germany
21/07/2006 Olympiastadion - Berlin, Germany
23/07/2006 Rhein Energie Stadion - Cologne, Germany
28/07/2006 Stade de France - Paris, France
31/07/2006 Amsterdam ArenA - Amsterdam, Netherlands
03/08/2006 Gottlieb-Daimler-Stadion - Stuttgart, Germany
05/08/2006 Dübendorf Airfield - Zurich, Switzerland
08/08/2006 Palais Nikaia - Nice, France
12/08/2006 Estádio do Dragão - Porto, Portugal
20/08/2006 Twickenham Stadium - London, England
22/08/2006 Twickenham Stadium - London, England
25/08/2006 Hampden Park - Glasgow, Scotland
27/08/2006 Don Valley Stadium - Sheffield, England
29/08/2006 Millennium Stadium - Cardiff, Wales
01/09/2006 Koengen - Bergen, Norway
03/09/2006 Forum Horsens Stadion - Horsens, Denmark


Number of markets actually played: 18

Note, both London shows and the Paris show did not sellout despite this being the first leg. There were ONLY 62,000 people at the Paris show. U2 just played to 186,000 people at two Paris shows, that were soldout in HOURS! Only one show in the Netherlands and NO shows in Ireland.

Also notice that there are NO shows in Spain, which helps Portugal and the Nice show in France, NO show in Rome which helps Milan, NO show in Belgium which MOGGIO claims naturally helps Paris, NO shows in Sweden which naturally helps Norway and Denmark shows.


Only 19 shows, yet most of them did not sellout!


STONES: A Bigger Bang Tour
European Tour 2ND LEG:

05/06/2007 Werchter Park (festival site) - Werchter, Belgium
08/06/2007 Goffert Park (festival site) - Nijmegen, Netherlands
10/06/2007 Isle of Wight Festival - Newport, Isle of Wight, England
13/06/2007 Commerzbank-Arena - Frankfurt, Germany
16/06/2007 Stade de France - Paris, France
18/06/2007 Stade Gerland - Lyon, France
21/06/2007 Estadio Olimpico de Montjuic - Barcelona, Spain
23/06/2007 Anoeta Stadium - San Sebastián, Spain
25/06/2007 Estadio Jose Alvalade XXI - Lisbon, Portugal
28/06/2007 Estadio Vicente Calderón - Madrid, Spain
30/06/2007 Estadio Municipal Santo Domingo - Almeria, Spain
06/07/2007 Stadio Olimpico - Rome, Italy
09/07/2007 Jaz Beach - Budva, Montenegro
14/07/2007 Ušće Park - Belgrade, Serbia
17/07/2007 Lia Manoliu Stadium - Bucharest, Romania
20/07/2007 The Puskás Ferenc Stadium - Budapest, Hungary
22/07/2007 Outdoor Exhibition Centre - Brno, Czech Republic
25/07/2007 Służewiec Race Horse Track - Warsaw, Poland
28/07/2007 Palace Square, by The Winter Palace - Saint Petersburg, Russia
01/08/2007 Olympiastadion - Helsinki, Finland
03/08/2007 Ullevi Stadium- Gothenburg, Sweden
05/08/2007 Idraetsparken - Copenhagen, Denmark
08/08/2007 Valle Hovin - Oslo, Norway
11/08/2007 Stade Olympique de la Pontaise - Lausanne, Switzerland
13/08/2007 LTU Arena - Düsseldorf, Germany
15/08/2007 HSH Nordbank Arena - Hamburg, Germany
18/08/2007 Slane Castle - County Meath, Ireland
21/08/2007 The O2 - London, England
23/08/2007 The O2 - London, England
26/08/2007 The O2 - London, England


This second leg of Europe only had an average attendance per night of 35,000! So on average, these shows were almost HALF EMPTY!


Yes its true, the Rolling Stones play multiple legs of the same region and skip around just like U2 on the same tour, except the results are not nearly as good.


The Rolling Stones A Bigger Bang Tour took a full two years. U2 360 will be completed in less than 18 months!

CosmoKramer

People like Moggio exist all over. They are haters of all other popular acts other than their own. Maoilbheannacht almost always states facts to back up his position. Facts that U2 fans should find interesting like sales stats and concert information. Moggio, and people like him, make a false statement and claim that it is fact

Moggio

Moggio

...and if you wanna believe wrestling is real, whatever makes you feel good...

Maoilbheannacht

Well, when U2 360 and Black Ice tours are completed, we'll see who has the higher gross figures in the markets you mentioned.
Lets also not forget that this is AC/DC's first tour since the year 2000.


Yep, we heard that the first time. But playing ONE arena show in Boston, is unlikely to prevent AC/DC from selling out a stadium show in Boston nearly a year later. We'll see what the figures look like IF AC/DC is willing to release them. Unless your going to claim that most of the people who saw ONE arena show in Boston elected not to see the stadium show a year later, its going to be rather difficult to claim that the reason Boston has not soldout is because of that single arena show back in 2008.

This also brings up another interesting fact. Not only have AC/DC failed to sellout these two stadium shows in the United States, it does not appear that AC/DC has EVER in the bands 36 year history, soldout a SINGLE stadium show in the United States, not even in New York City.

One of the reasons the Stones had to play a larger number of markets on the A Bigger Bang Tour was because there was not enough DEMAND for 2nd dates in many of the major markets.

A Bigger Bang Tour 2nd European Leg had the following results:

Shows: 30
GROSS: $117,272,808
Attendance: 1,056,550
average Gross: $3,909,093
average attendance: 35,218
average ticket price: $111

Despite playing many "NEW FRESH" markets on the 2nd leg, the results are pretty thin for an artist attempting to be the top concert draw.



The only market in Europe where demand was strong enough for the Stones to play two nights in a row was LONDON. Thats it, for both legs. The two Stones shows combined in London only drew about 100,000 people and neither one was soldout. The reason the Stones had no multiple nights in any given market except London was because they LACKED enough demand in any of those markets to play more than one show. The relatively low attendance and lack of sellouts proves that.

Thats because your reference was only to the European shows. The Stones did multiple legs of North America as well, with just as much strategic use of dates as U2 are any other artist promoted by Live Nation. Yep, thats right, the same people who promote the Stones also promote U2 and Madonna. Live Nation uses the best strategy for each artist to bring in the most amount of money. If Live Nation could have brought the Stones more money by playing multiple nights in Barcelona, Paris, Amsterdam, Milan etc, they would have booked the Stones that way. They didn't because the Stones did not have enough demand in those markets to play a second night!

ramblin rose

This thread is about the 360 Tour attendance and statistics. Please, let's not turn this into another "Will U2 Sellout Stadiums" thread.

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Maoilbheannacht

Here are some more interesting facts that MOGGIO does not want anyone to see:

While people debate whether U2 360 will beat the Stones next tour, take a look at what happened JUST outside the USA/Canada on both bands last two tours:

U2 VERTIGO (OUTSIDE USA/CANADA)
GROSS: $245,697,711
ATTENDANCE: 3,137,122
AVERAGE GROSS: $4,724,956
AVERAGE ATTENDANCE: 60,329
Average Ticket Price: $78.32
SHOWS: 52
SELLOUTS: 52


ROLLING STONES "A BIGGER BANG" (OUTSIDE USA/CANADA)
GROSS: $265,680,792
ATTENDANCE: 2,537,097
AVERAGE GROSS: $4,151,262
AVERAGE ATTENDANCE: 39,642
Average Ticket Price: $104.72
SHOWS: 64
SELLOUTS: 16


Notice that every U2 show with a possible few exceptions was soldout within hours of going on sale. The Rolling Stones by contrast failed to sellout 75% of their shows. Also notice that average gross for U2 per show was over $600,000 more!

While the Stones did barely beat U2 outside the USA/Canada by $20 million, essentially 5 more U2 shows would have put U2 over the top in this area. The Stones played more shows, yet had smaller attendance, smaller per show attendance, and smaller per show gross. Given that U2 nearly over took the Stones with a smaller number of shows, U2 will easily have the outside the USA/Canada market in their pocket on 360.

If the Stones have any chance of beating U2 360 with their next tour without announcing it as their final tour, it will only come from the USA/Canada market.

While the Stones have been consistently on top for many years, the last two tours show that the margin by which the Stones lead has shrunk considerably, and outside the USA/Canada essentially does not exist.

Given this trend, it is not surprising that many here suspect that
U2 will overtake the Stones with the 360 tour.

Maoilbheannacht

So then whats your prediction?

U2:

2009-2010 360 tour..... ?

Rolling Stones:

2010-? Next tour....?

Maoilbheannacht

Well, you did suggest that we should believe the following...

powerhour24

QFT.

After all squeezing a little cash out of ringtones and legal downloads isn't much compared with $56m grossed for 6 shows, if they played 100 shows at this rate on this tour, it'd gross more than $800m, that $100m+ investment wasn't so bad after all. Factor in the bonus of some more record sales and DVD sales, it gets better.

Magnificent should have saved the radio from mediocrity, but at least U2 proved where real impressive artistry counts, none of those acts who get more exposure on radio do all that much when it comes to 'live' performances.

Maoilbheannacht

The difference is that we can actually point to a post where you state these things, yet you have never provided any quotes from me where I actually say specifically what you claim. Its true that I thought, and still do think many markets on the Vertigo tour were heavily underbooked and both Arthur Fogul and Paul McGuinness have stated roughly the same thing. But I never said the ENTIRE TOUR, every show, was heavily underbooked.